Absolutely stunning statistics on out-of-wedlock births
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AustenFan
cradlerc
just4once
VicarJoe
8 posters
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Absolutely stunning statistics on out-of-wedlock births
I was truly amazed at this data, published in today's newspaper.
The first number is the percentage of children born out-of-wedlock in 1980, the second the number born out-of-wedlock in 2007. Prepare to be shocked.
Japan: 1% (1980), 2% (2007)
Italy: 4% (1980), 21% (2007)
Spain: 4% (1980), 28% (2007)
Canada: 13% (1980), 30% (2007)
Germany: 12% (1980), 30% (2007)
Ireland: 5% (1980), 33% (2007)
Netherlands: 4% (1980), 40% (2007)
U.S.: 18% (1980), 40% (2007)
U.K.: 12% (1980), 44% (2007)
Denmark: 33% (1980), 46% (2007)
France: 11% (1980), 50% (2007)
Norway: 15% (1980), 54% (2007)
Sweden: 40% (1980), 55% (2007)
Iceland: 40% (1980), 66% (2007)
WOW!
The first number is the percentage of children born out-of-wedlock in 1980, the second the number born out-of-wedlock in 2007. Prepare to be shocked.
Japan: 1% (1980), 2% (2007)
Italy: 4% (1980), 21% (2007)
Spain: 4% (1980), 28% (2007)
Canada: 13% (1980), 30% (2007)
Germany: 12% (1980), 30% (2007)
Ireland: 5% (1980), 33% (2007)
Netherlands: 4% (1980), 40% (2007)
U.S.: 18% (1980), 40% (2007)
U.K.: 12% (1980), 44% (2007)
Denmark: 33% (1980), 46% (2007)
France: 11% (1980), 50% (2007)
Norway: 15% (1980), 54% (2007)
Sweden: 40% (1980), 55% (2007)
Iceland: 40% (1980), 66% (2007)
WOW!
VicarJoe- Posts : 395
Join date : 2009-05-12
Location : Upstate NY
Re: Absolutely stunning statistics on out-of-wedlock births
Can't say I'm really shocked. Not to blame everything on the media but look how being an unwed mother is treated today as compared to yesteryear. Not that I want anyone shamed but nor do I want it celebrated and idolized as it is.
just4once- Posts : 46
Join date : 2009-05-13
Re: Absolutely stunning statistics on out-of-wedlock births
The U.S. numbers do surprise me. And I agree just4, there has to be some kind of happy medium between utter shame and celebration.
cradlerc- Posts : 296
Join date : 2009-05-12
Location : West Coast
Re: Absolutely stunning statistics on out-of-wedlock births
I think it has to do (in part) that in so many countries people just don't get married. They simply decide to live togther-often long term- and to have kids
AustenFan- Posts : 194
Join date : 2009-05-13
What I found remarkable
was first, that in 1980, we were so "virtuous" as compared to today. Usually, when I comment on the collapse of families, people say, "well, it's not the 1950s anymore, and you can't have June Cleaver and Jim Crow like you want...." No one ever says, "it's not 1980 anymore, and you can't have cocaine abuse and punk rock like you want...."
I've harbored the thought at times that people were in fact MORE liberal at the end of the seventies than today. But the stats don't bear that out, in terms of marriage and childbirth.
Maybe it's that one generation fought for this kind of freedom to be individualistic as against families on the ideological level, but they were still psychologically likely to adhere to the ideas they were raised with. Whereas the later stats are non-ideological, and simply represent the individualistic view become the norm. The 2007 generation of new parents weren't raised with the expectation of marriage and childbirth being connected.
Is it possible for someone to be more conservative ideologically and more liberal in action, as compared to an earlier generation? I think maybe it is. Maybe it takes a generation for our cultural revolutions to catch up with us.
The other thing I noted was that the countries we associate with being in the vanguard of doing away with religion also lead the world in illegitimacy. So there's the religion angle.
Finally, I'd note that as far as the shame vs celebration problem, there also seems to be a scale from shame to acceptance in terms of the language we use to describe the phenomenon. I used "out-of-wedlock" in the first post, borrowing it from the newspaper. I used "illegitimacy" in the last paragraph, which sounds a bit harsh to my ear, because it expresses some negativity attached to the thing. A few generations ago, the headline would have been "Bastardy on the rise," which you can't imagine today. It's beyond the pale. So as we soften the language we use, we probably in some way participate in legitimizing illegitimacy. In fact, I predict that very soon, within the next decade, we'll culturally move to a new term for the phenomenon that doesn't imply anything about wedlock. After all, "out-of-wedlock" sounds like wedlock is a good or normal thing, superior. Can't have that. Any guesses as to what term we'll be using in 2020 for out-of-wedlock births. Monadic births? Marriage is just a piece of paper births? Or maybe just births, and the category will no longer be recognized at all?
I've harbored the thought at times that people were in fact MORE liberal at the end of the seventies than today. But the stats don't bear that out, in terms of marriage and childbirth.
Maybe it's that one generation fought for this kind of freedom to be individualistic as against families on the ideological level, but they were still psychologically likely to adhere to the ideas they were raised with. Whereas the later stats are non-ideological, and simply represent the individualistic view become the norm. The 2007 generation of new parents weren't raised with the expectation of marriage and childbirth being connected.
Is it possible for someone to be more conservative ideologically and more liberal in action, as compared to an earlier generation? I think maybe it is. Maybe it takes a generation for our cultural revolutions to catch up with us.
The other thing I noted was that the countries we associate with being in the vanguard of doing away with religion also lead the world in illegitimacy. So there's the religion angle.
Finally, I'd note that as far as the shame vs celebration problem, there also seems to be a scale from shame to acceptance in terms of the language we use to describe the phenomenon. I used "out-of-wedlock" in the first post, borrowing it from the newspaper. I used "illegitimacy" in the last paragraph, which sounds a bit harsh to my ear, because it expresses some negativity attached to the thing. A few generations ago, the headline would have been "Bastardy on the rise," which you can't imagine today. It's beyond the pale. So as we soften the language we use, we probably in some way participate in legitimizing illegitimacy. In fact, I predict that very soon, within the next decade, we'll culturally move to a new term for the phenomenon that doesn't imply anything about wedlock. After all, "out-of-wedlock" sounds like wedlock is a good or normal thing, superior. Can't have that. Any guesses as to what term we'll be using in 2020 for out-of-wedlock births. Monadic births? Marriage is just a piece of paper births? Or maybe just births, and the category will no longer be recognized at all?
VicarJoe- Posts : 395
Join date : 2009-05-12
Location : Upstate NY
Softened/politically correct language
You make an excellent point about softened language, Joe. I used to work with a woman
who had a child, um, out of wedlock. She always took umbrage at the terms "illegitimate"
and "bastard." I agree that "bastard" in particular seems a bit pejorative, but today it
seems like nobody in the news and entertainment media is able to call a spade a spade.
who had a child, um, out of wedlock. She always took umbrage at the terms "illegitimate"
and "bastard." I agree that "bastard" in particular seems a bit pejorative, but today it
seems like nobody in the news and entertainment media is able to call a spade a spade.
SursumCorda- Posts : 54
Join date : 2009-05-13
Location : North Dakota
Wedlock numbers
The most shocking are Spain, France, Italy and Ireland IMO. Wow, I never realized it had gotten to this extreme.
Thereforeiam- Posts : 78
Join date : 2009-05-15
Location : Syracuse, NY
Welcome to the world of Juno
A snarky, smart a$$ kid who is never wrong, that knows more than her parents and....never seems to realize she should have kept her legs together. Oh well, at least she kept the baby.
stihl- Posts : 271
Join date : 2009-05-13
Location : Hills South of Syracuse
Socio-political implications...
My first thought on the matter was the socio-political implications of single parent households. It seems as though we had a discussion recently about how one parent households are a disproportionate number of the households with children living below the poverty line. It is one thing if circumstances beyond ones control put them in the position of being a single parent, but I don't think it was the intention for people to choose that situation and then expect or accept the assistance of the state. Politically, it seems as though people having children out of wedlock is an issue that political figures would point out and try to change to alleviate the burden that this puts on the state.
Someone pointed out this blog recently and I noticed that he also had a comment about the report that you cite.
http://gkupsidedown.blogspot.com/2009/05/more-unwed-moms-in-usa.html
Peace
Someone pointed out this blog recently and I noticed that he also had a comment about the report that you cite.
http://gkupsidedown.blogspot.com/2009/05/more-unwed-moms-in-usa.html
Peace
HumbleHank- Posts : 32
Join date : 2009-05-12
Location : Finger Lakes, NY
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